Top Engine steady

Started by Whee, February 23, 2022, 02:27:21 PM

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Whee

Need to replace the top engine steady bushes on a standard 850. I know rubber part quality is challenging. What do you think is the best option?

Standard or "upgraded"?
https://www.minisport.com/spdsp651-uprated-top-engine-steady-polyurethane-bush-kit.html
https://www.minisport.com/sb161-standard-rubber-top-engine-steady-bush.html

Or other options?
I'm not bothered about cost, but have a preference towards looking standard unless there is a real good reason for upgrade.

Thanks!

MiniDave

I'm not keen on poly bushes as they increase NVH in my experience....

The later model cars had a bushing with a sleeve bonded inside it - those are the ones I use.

http://www.minispares.com/product/Classic/Engine/Stabilisers_mounts/Stabilisers/KKF101320EVO.aspx?100201&ReturnUrl=/search/classic/engine%20stabilizer%20bush.aspx|Back%20to%20search
Complete failure at retirement

1989 Cooper Racing Green
2009 Clubman S
2014 Audi Allroad

Jimini II

I am not a fan of poly either, in years gone by they seemed to crumble.
I have been using poly on the engine side and rubber on the bulkhead side to keep vibrations down.
That being said I just installed a full set of poly in the Moke, supposedly the poly is a much better quality than the rubber we currently get.
I will let you know my thoughts when I drive it tomorrow as I am off to Sebring to watch some vintage racing.

Whee

Thanks folks. -23 windchill here today, so not quite Moking weather.

MiniDave

Awww, c'mon Peter! I've seen you Mokin in the snow!  ;D

8* here this ayem, so no shop work for me.....
Complete failure at retirement

1989 Cooper Racing Green
2009 Clubman S
2014 Audi Allroad

cstudep

Didn't want to start a new thread just to ask a stupid question and it's on this same topic so figured I would just ask it here.

Installing a HIF44 on my motor to replace the dual HS4's and have an issue with the bottom of the carb hitting the top "shelf" part of the firewall bulkhead. I have made a 1/4" spacer which puts the throttle mechanism and cable stay as close to the manifold as possible without hitting. I think my only option at this point is an adjustable top engine steady. Well they are out of stock everywhere except for the KAD version at 7 Mini Parts so I may make one but that is not my question.

How hard should it be to "rotate" the motor forward some? I don't think I need much  since it almost clears, but when I grab hold of the top of the motor and try to pull it forward it does not act like it wants to move at all. I was just curious how much resistance it should have. The motor in my engine stand moves easily but it of course does not have the Remote shift parts attaching it to anything at the bottom where the car does.

Just don't want to break anything trying to rotate it forward with whatever force I can apply with an adjustable top steady.

94touring

#6
It should move fairly easily once the engine steadies are removed.  It will have a little slop to tilt forward or backwards.

cstudep

#7
Ok I guess I need to do some more investigating because it does not move much at all, forward or back. The car did have some sort of lower rods that ran from the connection point of the remote shift housing to the trans up toward the front of the subframe. I removed those because they would have acted as some sort of lower engine steadies but it still will not move much. Perhaps the guy I got if off of has installed some other sort of supports somewhere.

I assume that with the remote shift tunnel part attaching back at the shifter area of the body that it might be more rigid than the other versions but didn't figure it should be this tight.

MiniDave

Yes, with the remote shift housing you have a very large, long engine steady that doesn't like to move - it uses a round rubber bobbin at the back to attach that end to the car, and those are generally not particularly soft rubber - if it's old it could be heat hardened by the exhaust too.

So, what to do? do you have the 1/2" spacer in between the plate and the carb? You can cut that down to 1/4" and it will still work OK.

I suppose you could slot the 5/16" motor mount holes in the subframe and move the engine forward, then you might need a similar sized spacer to add between the bobbin and the body to take up the gap?
Complete failure at retirement

1989 Cooper Racing Green
2009 Clubman S
2014 Audi Allroad

cstudep

#9
Yeah I started with a 3/8" spacer, then took that down to 1/4" which made a pretty big difference on how easy it was to get the carb in place but it still just hits as I start tightening down the manifold nuts. I can't imagine I need to rotate it much but like I said it basically does not move at all.

I think I can take another 1/32" to 1/16" or so out of the spacer and since I am printing my own I can pretty much make it whatever I want so I am going to try that and see what it gains me. I guess I will then need to look at that rear mount on the remote shift housing to see if maybe I can get some movement there.

The guy had all sorts of extra mounts on this thing, presumably to stiffen it up as much as possible since I know he used to take it to the track some. So it's hard telling what I might find back at that attachment point.

I was hoping this conversion would be pretty straight forward and easy, so far it's been nothing but a pain in the butt. I should have known better.

Looking at the parts diagram for the mount at the rear it looks like there could possibly be some slight adjustment there? Not sure if that is what I will see in the real world back there but it gives me hope at least LOL

Willie_B

What intake manifold are you using? They are all slightly different as to where the carb sits. One from a Metro works well for that.

cstudep

The mini spares version. It was all I could find at the time I was looking. I could not find a metro one that was in decent shape, reasonably priced, and would ship to the US.

gr8kornholio

I believe the body to housing mounting plate of the remote shift has slots. If you loosen the 3 bolts this may give you some play.
I am the GR8KORNHOLIO! Are you threatening me?

Saussie Aussie 1965 Australian MK1 Mini.
"Beavis" - 07 MY/MY MCS, B/MY Konig Daylites, JCW sideskirts, TSW springs, TSW lower rear control arms -- Exploring the country with new friends since 11/09.

LarryLebel

The slots are to keep p/n 41 under compression. If its under tension the rubber and metal will pull apart in no time at all.

cstudep

Well I crawled under it this morning and the rubber mount at the rear is still pliable and I can get it to move around back there so not going to mess with it.

Not sure why it didn't occur to me earlier but since I am 3d printing my own spacer I can print it with a slight angle built in rather than just flat. That should allow me to rotate the carb up just slightly so that it does not hit.

Going to give it a go and see how it works.

MiniDave

Don't go too far, if you do the angle will be wrong for the float in the bottom of the carb.
Complete failure at retirement

1989 Cooper Racing Green
2009 Clubman S
2014 Audi Allroad

cstudep

Yeah I think I need a degree or less. It does not hit until I start tightening down the manifold nuts which obviously squares it up better with the block and that is when it hits......just barely.

cstudep

#17
Well I am pleased to say that it worked! Ended up using around a 0.75 degree angle which ends up being 0.25" thick at the top and tapers out to a little less than 0.30" at the bottom.

Bolted it on and it fired right off. It will only idle with choke on, but its been fairly cool yet and I haven't started it in about a month so I think I'll let it idle with the choke on and let it warm up a bit to see if it will run without it.

The bracket where the throttle and choke cables mount is missing the necessary clamp thing for the choke and the little round cable stop thing for the throttle so I can't hook those up yet but I was pleased it started.

Its hard to see much angle here but its definitely angled just enough to fix my problem.

BruceK

WooHoo!  Congrats on getting it sorted out.
1988 Austin Mini
2002 MINI Cooper S
1992 Toyota LiteAce (JDM)
1997 Jeep Wrangler Sahara

tmsmini

I am a little late, but I may have an adjustable steady that I never used.
Also the metro manifold gives you another 1/4 of an inch at least.
I posted this awhile back on the Mini Forum
https://www.theminiforum.co.uk/forums/topic/346138-cam6618-vs-mg-metro-inlet-manifold/

I may have a manifold as well, but one has no warming circuit pipe ends and another would require some work on the manifold stud tabs.
I bought a few as i kept finding better condition versions.
Sounds like you have it sorted out though.

MiniDave

I may need one of those angled spacers for the SPi engine I'm building - so keep the file handy, It's going in a 64 Mini with the Minispares manifold and HIF44 carb. However, this car won't be ready for the motor till next year sometime.....so no rush!  ::) ;D
Complete failure at retirement

1989 Cooper Racing Green
2009 Clubman S
2014 Audi Allroad

cstudep

Quote from: tmsmini on April 24, 2022, 06:33:23 PM
I am a little late, but I may have an adjustable steady that I never used.
Also the metro manifold gives you another 1/4 of an inch at least.
I posted this awhile back on the Mini Forum
https://www.theminiforum.co.uk/forums/topic/346138-cam6618-vs-mg-metro-inlet-manifold/

I may have a manifold as well, but one has no warming circuit pipe ends and another would require some work on the manifold stud tabs.
I bought a few as i kept finding better condition versions.
Sounds like you have it sorted out though.

I very much appreciate the offer! I found a pretty nice looking Metro manifold on ebay this afternoon while waiting on my spacer to print so I went ahead and bought it, I need another manifold I can use with an old HS4 carb in my engine test stand anyway to try and get an old 1275 auto running, which is what the mini spares manifold was actually for.

But when I ran across a HIF44 awhile back for pretty cheap that had the abutment bracket, cone filter, etc.. I had to buy it since I have been wanting one for my car. It didn't have a manifold so I had to steal the one off the engine stand motor. I may swap the car to the metro one or may just leave it as it is since my spacer seems to work ok. In this case I am not sure the adjustable top steady would have helped much since the motor does not seem to want to rotate all that much.

cstudep

Quote from: MiniDave on April 24, 2022, 06:41:45 PM
I may need one of those angled spacers for the SPi engine I'm building - so keep the file handy, It's going in a 64 Mini with the Minispares manifold and HIF44 carb. However, this car won't be ready for the motor till next year sometime.....so no rush!  ::) ;D

Shouldn't be a problem I have about 6 different spacers now modeled up and have printed 2 different 1/4" ones, a 3/8" one and 2 different ones for the HS4 setup I initially had on the test stand. Now I have the angled one to go along with the others. In a few months I should have a pretty good idea how well the printed spacer holds up to the heat and fuel. I soaked one of the previously printed spacers in a bowl of fuel for 4 days just to see how it would hold up and it seemed fine, it didn't get soft or anything so I think it's at least somewhat resistant to fuel. We will see how well it does with the heat/fuel combo but if it does not hold up I will likely already have something that will by the time you need it. 4.gif

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