Sprite Ribcase Gearbox Overhaul

Started by MiniDave, July 19, 2016, 02:37:27 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

MiniDave

Yeah, I thought he might put it in the Bugeye while I rebuilt that one.....if I can get the engine for the '68 running he may put it in that one........that's the car I  thought I was building it for.

Who knows???
Complete failure at retirement

1989 Cooper Racing Green
2009 Clubman S
2014 Audi Allroad

MiniDave

#51
Working on gearbox #2, I decided not to bead blast this one but just took it apart and cleaned it in the solvent tank - no question bead blasting them looks great but it's such a mess to clean up.

This one was in considerably better shape than the first one, all it took was the overhaul kit which has new bearings, laygear shaft and bearings, seals and gaskets and synchros. This one also had been apart before and I found one detent ball missing and an incorrect spring behind one of the shift locating plungers. I also found the pin that holds the reverse gear shaft in place was bent - I have no idea how they did that but I was able to straighten it again and save it - as those are NLA parts.

When I got it it was locked in two gears and the shift linkage was bound up, once I got it apart I found the missing detent ball and I think that's how it got into two gears at once. Overall the first and reverse gears are not as banged up on this one and once finished I would use this one over the 1st one I built for him. I still have two more gearboxes to build for this guy if he goes ahead with them.......

I'll finish it up this afternoon, then I need to start work on my green Mini, we have a driving event coming up and there are lots of little things I want to do before I hit the road.
Complete failure at retirement

1989 Cooper Racing Green
2009 Clubman S
2014 Audi Allroad

MiniDave

Complete failure at retirement

1989 Cooper Racing Green
2009 Clubman S
2014 Audi Allroad

MPlayle

That one went together lots faster than the last one!

MiniDave

Nah, I just posted the pics together.....but you're right, once you've done a few it's less of a mystery. Each one presents it's own little issues tho.

Of course, I didn't have to send a part off to Jeff to b re-engineered too!
Complete failure at retirement

1989 Cooper Racing Green
2009 Clubman S
2014 Audi Allroad

pbraun

Great thread! I am looking to rebuild my ribcase trany very soon, and this is very helpful. Looks quite similar to a Mini trany, but easier to get to and no drop gears ha ha.

Now to read over the manual before disassembly.

p.s. Ever hear of installing the trany and motor separately being an easier go of it?
Peter
65 Moke
60 Bugeye modified
66 Jaguar XJ13 ( I can wish )

Willie_B

#56
Quote from: pbraun on January 31, 2017, 02:22:20 PM

p.s. Ever hear of installing the trany and motor separately being an easier go of it?

On Sprites/Midgets the tunnel area is enclosed on the bottom. It has to go back in as engine/trans unit.

MiniDave

#57
You have to pull the motor to get the trans out, just like on my E-Type.....

There are only a few "gotchas' on the Sprite box, make sure you get all the inter-shift rail plungers back in, and in the right place, and the sequence of installation is important - follow the book for sure.

Other than that, not too bad....the thrust washers for the layshaft can be a bit fiddly too....

Victoria British sells a kit with all new bearings, layshaft, synchros and gaskets/seals that has pretty much everything you need in one kit.

Good luck, and post it up one you're into it!
Complete failure at retirement

1989 Cooper Racing Green
2009 Clubman S
2014 Audi Allroad

pbraun

Well, started last week by pulling the engine/tranny and separating both, bring home the tranny.

Now, it's all disassembled except for the 1st motion shaft that I cant figure out how to get that nut off of the bearing side, front, as the gear won't just go through the case. It also seems to have lost a bit of the coating, but I will reuse anyway. Not making noise there, just 1st and reverse, that I hope a new layshaft and maybe 1st gear will clean up, with bearings.
Peter
65 Moke
60 Bugeye modified
66 Jaguar XJ13 ( I can wish )

MiniDave

#59
The first motion shaft goes out thru the case - to the inside......it is held in place on the engine side by a lock ring. I remember locking the gear in the vice and then tightening the nut......then you push the assembly in thru the inside of the case. You have to leave it forward (bearing protruding thru the case on the clutch side as far as it will go) so that you can get the layshaft into place.

I think the kit from Victoria British is the easiest way to get the parts you'll need.....everything is in the kit except first gear, new synchros, gaskets, bearings and a new layshaft inner shaft and bearings.

BTW, I see this guy ever so often, he still hasn't used the gearbox, it's just sitting under his workbench. Instead he bought a Spitfire he's rebuilding, he sold the '68 Sprite without an engine to someone with a good motor and a rusty body.
Complete failure at retirement

1989 Cooper Racing Green
2009 Clubman S
2014 Audi Allroad

pbraun

Yeah, but I can't get the old one out! Does not seem happy drifting out the rear, above the largest. Beating myself up again. Will prob get it tomorrow, as has been the case with this job.

Found a good, used input shaft and other new layshafts & bearings from MM.

I think that will fix the odd noise from 1st gear.

Darn, if that guy doesn't want that box, ....i would make a reasonable offer! Let him know if it might work, please.
Peter
65 Moke
60 Bugeye modified
66 Jaguar XJ13 ( I can wish )

BruceK

On somewhat a related subject, I came across this Datsun 5-speed gearbox (with a car and engine still attached) for sale.    I know these are sometimes used as alternatives for Spridgets and Minors so I'm just throwing this out there since non-Z Datsuns have all but disappeared.

https://dallas.craigslist.org/dal/cto/d/1977-datsun-b210/6361140356.html
1988 Austin Mini
2002 MINI Cooper S
1992 Toyota LiteAce (JDM)
1997 Jeep Wrangler Sahara

MiniDave

#62
It won't come out if the laygear is still in place.....other than that it should just drift out - this is a ribcase transmission, right?
don't get the bearing cocked in the opening or it will bind.

I'll ask him what he wants for one of them......

good point Bruce, cheap way to get a 5 speed....probably need an adaptor kit too
Complete failure at retirement

1989 Cooper Racing Green
2009 Clubman S
2014 Audi Allroad

pbraun

Yep, definitely a ribcase. Laygear is there, but no shaft in place, so it's down in the hollow area of the case, won't interfere.

Must be I've managed to jam the bearing somehow....will retry, gently.

Yeah, a Datsun 5 speed is a good alternative, even those getting hard to find. But I'll go to many lengths to keep this part of the bugI of at least British origin.
Peter
65 Moke
60 Bugeye modified
66 Jaguar XJ13 ( I can wish )

MPlayle

It looks like the Rivergate 5-speed conversion kit is still available at http://www.rivergate5speed.com.


MiniDave

Looks like about $2000 if you do the speedo, including the trans - more if you need to o'haul your 5 speed before you install it. A lot cheaper than doing it to my E-Type!
Complete failure at retirement

1989 Cooper Racing Green
2009 Clubman S
2014 Audi Allroad

BruceK

#66
Wouldn't be great if there was a Japanese 5-speed gearbox that we could fit to our classic Minis?  Whenever I haven't driven my Mini for a while I find myself reaching for a non-existent 5th gear.
1988 Austin Mini
2002 MINI Cooper S
1992 Toyota LiteAce (JDM)
1997 Jeep Wrangler Sahara

MiniDave

Complete failure at retirement

1989 Cooper Racing Green
2009 Clubman S
2014 Audi Allroad

pbraun

Peter
65 Moke
60 Bugeye modified
66 Jaguar XJ13 ( I can wish )

MiniDave

Pbraun,  my friend said he'd take $500 for either of the two gearboxes I overhauled for him. That sounds pretty cheap to me as the parts were about $250.....that included all new synchros, new bearings, new layshaft and bearings and all the gaskets and seals.
Complete failure at retirement

1989 Cooper Racing Green
2009 Clubman S
2014 Audi Allroad

pbraun

Oh, well....... almost ready to reassemble mine now, with all the same new goodies. Just have to get all the bearing, springs and balls in the right places and right pieces.......   

Would have taken you up on that a month ago before I ordered the parts.
Peter
65 Moke
60 Bugeye modified
66 Jaguar XJ13 ( I can wish )

pbraun

Got everything rebuilt and back in the box, except the shift rods and forks.  Then, just as I was falling asleep, I realized I had forgotten to shim the big rear bearing on both sides, as the direction sheet said.   Oh, well, just have to tap that flange out, shim and reinstall. Must remember to put the front cover on, or something, to keep the layshaft from falling out when I turn the box upside down to drift in the flange and bearing straight. That's what happened yesterday.  Soon, it will be easier after doing that PIA job 5 times yesterday!  11.gif
Peter
65 Moke
60 Bugeye modified
66 Jaguar XJ13 ( I can wish )

MiniDave

Ha! I feel your pain! For me one of the harder parts was getting the shims to hold still as I slid the tail of the gearbox on and bolted it up - it was far too easy for one of the shims to slip sideways just a tiny bit and get caught by the housing, but the shims I was working with weren't nice new flat ones.....

There is a definite order to how you assemble the internals, no question.....I had the first one apart and together about 5 times before I got it all in there correctly - the second one I did was MUCH easier!
Complete failure at retirement

1989 Cooper Racing Green
2009 Clubman S
2014 Audi Allroad

MiniDave

Well, this is a timely refresher.....Sat I'm picking up another ribcase trans for an overhaul - this one is in a race car so it's a close ratio box I'm building for Clancy's newest box-Sprite racer  - otherwise I'd just tell him to use one of the ones I already overhauled for Alan.
Complete failure at retirement

1989 Cooper Racing Green
2009 Clubman S
2014 Audi Allroad

pbraun

So, I need help.  Put the shims (on the main shaft bearing) in as directed and now the bearing retainer doesn't sit flush with the case on the outside.

Dave - do you have any idea what could cause this? 

I also need help with the balls, springs and detents.  Do you still have that guide you could post or send along via email?

I must get this done right!


Thanks!!
Peter
65 Moke
60 Bugeye modified
66 Jaguar XJ13 ( I can wish )

­čí▒ ­čí│