House type, not block heaters in this case.
Anyone price one lately?
I'm having one installed today, the quote was $1225 for a 40 gallon and $1250 for a 50 gallon - I went with the larger one cause - why not? Of course that includes the permit, the expansion chamber (required now for code compliance) a new gas valve and flex line and removal of the old one, flex line connections, new pipes and shut off valves and who knows what else. I know the guy doing the work - he's my neighbor up the street - and he does quality work....but still!
Holy crap that's a lot of money for a damn water heater!
Of course, at my age I seriously doubt I'll ever have to buy another one....
I also found out today that our 2 year old washing machine is leaking water from someplace - it never ends! The old saying is true, a Man's home is his hassle!
I had the washing machine that came with our house start leaking shortly after we moved in. Took it apart and needed to replace a hose and all was good. Not exactly the most fun project though. Our water heater is a 40 or 50 and I'd like to go up to a 60-80 or whatever the biggest one is. If we both take showers on a cold morning, with it traveling 3 stories from the outside carport closet, someone is getting warm water after a short period of time. Usually me cause Jen likes to boil her skin off.
I replaced a neighbors 40 gal gas WH last week. Just the WH and two flex hoses and a new gas line was close $500. Did not install an expansion tank. The fun part was it was in a dug out dirt area under the house. Crawl in to reach the stand up part. So I think $1225 is about right. She got a quote for 1800 but they would have had to do it up to code.
A permit to replace a water heater WTF?
Yep. I replaced it myself about 22 years ago and did not pull a permit, and if I were doing it this time I probably wouldn't pull one this time either.
City has to get their cut I guess, as I seriously doubt they send someone out to inspect it later.
Plumber just called and said he hurt his back loading the new heater and he won't be by for a couple of days till he recovers. The old one is still working so we're not without hot water, but it's supposed to snow three inches on Wed......and get really cold too. He'll have to shut off the gas at the main as he's going to change the gas valve on the heater line too.
When I lived in a suburb of Dallas about five years ago I needed a permit for a new water heater. The heater could not be turned on until a post-install city inspection was completed.
If that's the case then maybe it's good that it didn't go in today, I'd hate to not have any hot water overnight,,,the bride would NOT be happy.
Quote from: BruceK on November 29, 2020, 04:52:42 PM
When I lived in a suburb of Dallas about five years ago I needed a permit for a new water heater. The heater could not be turned on until a post-install city inspection was completed.
I thought texas didn't have permits for much of anything I heard until a few years ago you could build a house with no permits.
I'm with you Dave if doing it myself they don't need to know.
Yep = I know about ~1000$ - $1200 is the cost for the whole assembly by a licensed plumber and up to code. I have been in the home store when a shopper says ' Oh i need a new HW heater" and the sales agent comes thru and offers advise and their jaw drops and hits the floor with that same type of " quote" of price + Code requirements from a plumber.
6 ish yrs ago = my original tank died = I needed HW in the house = Bought one . / installed it same night = chugging still.
Same for helping a neighbor friend.. His leaked out = + was blown away by the ' Liscened " requirement.. I also helped him do a direct replacement.
Learning about the expansion tank assembly requirement = I'm half prepared if it ever comes up to install it ( myself) if we were to sell the house ( it should come up on an home inspection report = and thats what a buyer wants to pick apart) prepared to do it before it became an issue. Its safety for sure = but agreed = my house = my rules :)
Quote from: jeff10049 on November 29, 2020, 11:28:26 PM
Quote from: BruceK on November 29, 2020, 04:52:42 PM
When I lived in a suburb of Dallas about five years ago I needed a permit for a new water heater. The heater could not be turned on until a post-install city inspection was completed.
I thought texas didn't have permits for much of anything I heard until a few years ago you could build a house with no permits.
I'm with you Dave if doing it myself they don't need to know.
Metropolitan areas, such as the DFW metroplex, seem to have more rules and regulations. I live in a rural, unincorporated area and I did not need any permits to build my detached garage recently But that exclusion was because it was not built for human habitation. Had it been, some permits and county inspections would have been involved. But I'm sure they would be much less than in an urban area.
like I said, I did it myself 20+ years ago, but there's no way I can lug one of those things down stairs into the basement now between my heart, head and knee.....it's hell getting older when you find you can't do stuff that used to be so easy.
Plus too and also, I've got no way to get rid of the old one.
I hope he gets to feeling better soon, for both his and our sake.
Ours is still working and it's not leaking so we're not dire......but I need to tear into the washing machine and find out why it's leaking - but only sometimes - and get it fixed. I swear she does a load of something damn near everyday! ::)
I'm not upset about the price he's charging - I don't expect him to work for free - but it's about 3 times as much as when I did the last one, so it did catch me out a bit....
Need to go build a bunch of motors to pay for it..... ;D
My brother-in-law is a plumber so I just call him. I get stuff at his cost and he doesn't usually charge me labor but I pay him something anyway.
We do not have permits for anything where I am, but I do not live within a town or city limits.
I do know the price of the water heaters themselves have basically doubled in the last 10 years or so, so that it a lot of the increase.
I think when ours gives up the ghost this time we are going to install one of the on demand water heaters. According to my BIL they have come quite a long way of late and are not much more than a traditional water heater. He says you have to have gas and soft water though, the electric ones are not efficient and hard water will destroy them in pretty short order.
One of the many advantages of rural living! 77.gif
Indeed it is, the disadvantage being I have to drive 45min one way to get to anything resembling a lowes/home depot type store and 20min one way to get to a wal-mart. 4.gif
Worth it in my opinion.....
I was quoted $1200 from a local plumber 2 winters ago and told it would take 5 days for them to get to me.
I took one cold shower, went promptly to Home Depot, purchased a 50 gallon for $400 and saw these cool new shark bite conversions where you cut off the pipes and slide these suckers on totally eliminating the need to sweat pipes.
https://www.homedepot.com/p/SharkBite-3-4-in-Push-to-Connect-x-3-4-in-FIP-x-18-in-Braided-Stainless-Steel-Water-Heater-Connector-with-Integrated-Ball-Valve-u3088flex18bvlf/202685676
The entire removal and install took me about 30 minutes. Whole deal cost me about $500 all in.
Then there was a problem of what to do with the old unit since putting it to the curb would invite a visit from the county looking for a permit......
The house across the street was vacant and foreclosed on.
It somehow ended up in that driveway at 11:30 at night the night before trash pickup.
It was gone by 0600 when I left for work, pretty sure a trash picker grabbed it for the scrap value.
Yeah those shark bites are the real deal. Expensive but a piece of cake to use and they work quite well I am told.
Around here if you want something gone you sit it out by the curb, if it's got any scrap value at all it will be gone before the morning.
Luckily I have some people by the shop that scrap metal.
I wouldn't be surprised if the same thing happens here - I know I've gotten rid of some stuff that way - put it on the curb and put a sign on it that says "Free to a good home" ;D
I don't know if that would work on a water heater, neighbors might get unhappy, especially if it stayed out there a few days.
No matter, I'm not up to dragging it up the basement stairs and out to the curb anyway.
Speaking of non-official curbside pickup, we're currently under a burn ban so we have been raking leaves and putting them in big 45 gallon heavy duty yard bags. Each time we bring them to the curb for the trash to pick up, somebody nabs them first before the trash man comes. No idea why somebody wants big bags full of leaves but I would like to encourage them to come and rake up all the leaves they want off my property - no charge!
Quote from: BruceK on November 30, 2020, 03:44:42 PM
Speaking of non-official curbside pickup, we're currently under a burn ban so we have been raking leaves and putting them in big 45 gallon heavy duty yard bags. Each time we bring them to the curb for the trash to pick up, somebody nabs them first before the trash man comes. No idea why somebody wants big bags full of leaves but I would like to encourage them to come and rake up all the leaves they want off my property - no charge!
The toilet paper shortage has gotten that bad?
Quote from: MiniDave on November 30, 2020, 03:04:16 PM
I wouldn't be surprised if the same thing happens here - I know I've gotten rid of some stuff that way - put it on the curb and put a sign on it that says "Free to a good home" ;D
I don't know if that would work on a water heater, neighbors might get unhappy, especially if it stayed out there a few days.
No matter, I'm not up to dragging it up the basement stairs and out to the curb anyway.
If Ed could build a castle out of 1,100 tons of coral stone, with no machines all by hand, Dave can figure out a low impact way to drop a HW Heater into the basement and pull the old one out.
https://coralcastle.com/
Whadya talking about, I found a NO impact way to get it down there! :D
Quote from: BruceK on November 30, 2020, 03:44:42 PM
Speaking of non-official curbside pickup, we're currently under a burn ban so we have been raking leaves and putting them in big 45 gallon heavy duty yard bags. Each time we bring them to the curb for the trash to pick up, somebody nabs them first before the trash man comes. No idea why somebody wants big bags full of leaves but I would like to encourage them to come and rake up all the leaves they want off my property - no charge!
I'd guess people with compost piles are picking them up. It's one of the highly desired carbon inputs that you can only really get in the fall. What's easier than driving around looking for bags full someone else has already raked up for you.
Quote from: BruceK on November 30, 2020, 03:44:42 PM
Speaking of non-official curbside pickup, we're currently under a burn ban so we have been raking leaves and putting them in big 45 gallon heavy duty yard bags. Each time we bring them to the curb for the trash to pick up, somebody nabs them first before the trash man comes. No idea why somebody wants big bags full of leaves but I would like to encourage them to come and rake up all the leaves they want off my property - no charge!
Burn ban? and I have snow in the yard. Time to get on with our move plans. I'm sick of the cold winter started in Oct and won't end till late June.
So, how far south are you going to go? 8.gif
So on water heater subject what's everyone's opinion on tankless? We had an electric one in the last house and loved it. This house if we did one it'd be gas.
Pretty much all you see in Europe. I've never owned one but for a typical American household you'd need a pretty big one - since it has to supply showers, dishwasher, clothes washer etc.
A friend of mine here in San Antonio uses one in his home. His is electric and not overly large (whole house and 2-3 persons). They are sized according to need: whole house versus single sink, 1-2 persons versus 5-6 persons.
Gas vs. Electric: Gas ones heat faster.
Both require a minimum flow rate to activate - if you turn on just a trickle of hot water, they may not come on.
Both may require having special plumbing for being able to run a circulation of cleaning solution - especially if you live in a hard water area (like running vinegar through your coffee pot to clean it).
I mentioned the tankless earlier. My BIL the plumber says they are good to go these days. Gas if you can, the electric ones just are not anywhere near as efficient and do not seem to last as long.
Hard water is the big killer (but it also kills traditional water heaters as well) so a water softener is preferred if you have hard water, otherwise you may require multiple cleanings per year to keep one going well if you have real hard water. The cleaning process is pretty straight forward these days as well.
He just recently installed 4 fairly large ones in some sort of series/parallel setup at a local car wash, they are all linked together with CAT5 and communicate with each other. They keep track of how long they have run and cycle through which is the "main" one based on hours to keep them all at about the same usage. Pretty neat stuff really, they have come quite a long way since first coming on scene in the US, like Dave said they have been around for decades in Europe.
We had to backwash ours every month or so. Really just had to go hit a button and it spewed a bunch of water out a pipe that was routed from it to the flower bed.
We built my son's house in 2007 and installed a Rennai on demand. (Rennai at the time was the gold standard) We ran it off a propane tank. the gas service pipe had to be larger than for a normal WH for the proper size WH. It was still good when we moved in 2018 longer than i expected. The cleaning cycle is new to me but sounds like a good idea.
Our mistake was running recirculating hot water through the hot water line to supply hot water immediately to the faucet. Just before we moved we had a leak in the copper supply pipe in the spare bathroom. House was built with plumbing in the slab with copper. Did consider PEX but was too new to take a chance. We replaced all the plumbing with PEX going overhead and down the walls. $10,000 repair job and lucky it wasn't more. Found out circulating hot water thru copper pipe will corrode the pipe very quickly. Originally in PEX thru the slab would not have been a problem. Live and learn.
The cleaning cycles in the tankless water heaters is mostly for hard water regions. The calcium/limestone buildup clogs them faster if heating hard water versus soft water.
Most of Texas (especially the San Antonio area and hill country) is fed by limestone aquifers = very hard water.
Most lake/river reservoirs tend to be considered soft water.